Happy Days in Random Chatter 10

[Craig Jessop]

Love is dead and I will die alone.

[Portia]

Love is dead and I will die alone.

Sending virtual Talenti your way.

If you do psychoanalysis ... no time like the present.

[yayfulness]

Pulling this from another place because what I have to say isn't relevant to that topic but it seems worth saying.

When I first stopped going to church it was something like that. It didn't have anything to do with church history or a specific lack of belief. It was just too hard. Trying to explain that to people at the time was very hard. It was a big loss, but I just couldn't go anymore.

When my wife says she stopped going to church because of the way people at church treated her, I think that this is the part that people (read: my mom) don't understand. It's not that you stop going because you're offended or because you don't like the people there. You stop going because the act of going to church makes you feel miserable. You can't just wish that away.

That's also why my attempts at being an agnostic but practicing Mormon have had such mixed success. Sometimes it works, but sometimes it's just too painful to continue, and eventually you reach the point where unless you have a really specific reason to keep trying, you don't.

[Portia]

It's not that you stop going because you're offended or because you don't like the people there. You stop going because the act of going to church makes you feel miserable.

I was straight-up sick of everything about the LDS singles scene, even more so my home ward. The best way to describe it is, were they the type of people I would associate with, if it were up to me? It ended up being a "hell, no." And yeah, I was put off by the teachings on women, but I'm not going to lie and say, oh yeah, I really miss something valuable.

I may feed into negative stereotypes for some, but that's their business, not mine. Not being part of their club doesn't seem to have actually made the world stop on its axis, right? I guess my family is sort of dysfunctionally Mormon, anyway, but it always struck me as the epitome of bad boundaries to be that caught up in your adult children's lives.

Of course my life is filled with lovely people of all faith persuasions, including none, but I straight-up just LIKE not going to Church more, and I feel like that's a valid reason. I actually got much better mileage with this reason than the history/sociology/philosophy arguments.

My family and friends aren't such sadists that they think I should be miserable, thankfully.

[Portia]

I do miss many of the aspects of BYU, to be fair, but I suppose I was mildly active for a long time, and I think the values of liberal academia and the values of suburban SLC Mormons aren't terribly alike.

I think a part of me would love to go back to BYU if it were more open, but it seems like I'm finally coming around to finding a niche on the outside.

Also, Notre Dame is a bit more hardline than I realized: I thought they allowed non-believers. I bet BYU doesn't have Jewish or Muslim clubs?

http://ndsmcobserver.com/2011/10/atheis ... ub-status/

[Portia]

I'm trying on the gay label right now for the first time in... six years? Seven? I tried it on when I was first considering queer labels when I realized I wasn't straight. I settled on queer (bisexual if pushed) and then bisexual, and now I think possibly I was gay all along but heteronormativity-ed. It's an interesting cluster. Maybe some day I'll come out as gay, or maybe I'm wrong, or maybe I'm right but I just won't make a thing out of it. Cheers.

Is there a reason you prefer "gay" over other labels, specifically "lesbian"? That would be my default descriptor, and I hadn't heard that "lesbian" as either a noun or adjective was a term to avoid in general.

Just personal preference?

(Now you have Turn It Off stuck in my head. Haha)

[TheBlackSheep]

When my wife says she stopped going to church because of the way people at church treated her, I think that this is the part that people (read: my mom) don't understand. It's not that you stop going because you're offended or because you don't like the people there. You stop going because the act of going to church makes you feel miserable. You can't just wish that away.

That's also why my attempts at being an agnostic but practicing Mormon have had such mixed success. Sometimes it works, but sometimes it's just too painful to continue, and eventually you reach the point where unless you have a really specific reason to keep trying, you don't.

It got to the point right before I stopped going that my depression and anxiety would measurably amp up day by day as I got closer to Sundays. Then I spent the summer I left the church holed up in my bedroom, leaving my apartment maybe once or twice a week for groceries and a family gathering I couldn't beg off. Being that isolated is some pretty intense depression, and for me that had a lot to do with trying to be active in the church at the end. I've told people that, but I feel like they don't understand or they don't want to understand. So your wife and other people who just really struggle to go have my sympathy.

[TheBlackSheep]

(Now you have Turn It Off stuck in my head. Haha)

I love that song. My hetero side just won!

Is there a reason you prefer "gay" over other labels, specifically "lesbian"? That would be my default descriptor, and I hadn't heard that "lesbian" as either a noun or adjective was a term to avoid in general.

Just personal preference?

Yeah, it's just my personal preference. Someone could call me a lesbian and I wouldn't necessarily mind. Some gay women prefer the gay label, and some lesbians prefer the lesbian label.

There is a lot, historically, tied up in the lesbian label. Back in the day, there was a lot of animosity between gay men and lesbians. The gay men really treated lesbians very poorly and either left them out of considerations regarding gay rights or even fought against them. (Of course, trans people were mistreated by all gay people who contributed to trans erasure and transphobia in a lot of ways in order to further their own goals.) Despite this, during the AIDS crisis, lesbians (who were at less risk of contracting the virus because they were somewhat less promiscuous and because their sex acts were at less risk of transmitting the virus) were some of the primary caretakers of sick and dying gay men, and they were some of their primary advocates. After that, they were treated significantly better by gay men. I am proud to be associated with those women (and with the gay men who handled AIDS with so much goodness, dignity, tenacity, and bravery). Still, there is a lot of us vs. them that I still feel when I hear the word "lesbian." We call same sex attraction "being gay." Why then should I use a different term for myself just because I'm a woman? Maybe that is an unusual reaction. I know my girlfriend prefers to call herself gay to calling herself a lesbian too.

These past few months I have started to soften on the lesbian word though, as I have considered how much toxic masculinity really has impacted my life. But that's a different story for another time.

Additionally, the term lesbian is much more sexualized by straight men than the term gay is. I have spent enough time having my sex life and attractions sexualized by people that I did not invite to do so. I'm over it. So it's one reason the term lesbian isn't my first choice.

Also, the use of lesbian as an adjective gives me the willies. One is a lesbian; it is a noun. That also bothers me as I like that gay is an adjective. (Using gay or gays as a noun also gives me the willies.)

[Portia]

(Now you have Turn It Off stuck in my head. Haha)

I love that song. My hetero side just won!

Is there a reason you prefer "gay" over other labels, specifically "lesbian"? That would be my default descriptor, and I hadn't heard that "lesbian" as either a noun or adjective was a term to avoid in general.

Just personal preference?

Yeah, it's just my personal preference. Someone could call me a lesbian and I wouldn't necessarily mind. Some gay women prefer the gay label, and some lesbians prefer the lesbian label.

There is a lot, historically, tied up in the lesbian label. Back in the day, there was a lot of animosity between gay men and lesbians. The gay men really treated lesbians very poorly and either left them out of considerations regarding gay rights or even fought against them. (Of course, trans people were mistreated by all gay people who contributed to trans erasure and transphobia in a lot of ways in order to further their own goals.) Despite this, during the AIDS crisis, lesbians (who were at less risk of contracting the virus because they were somewhat less promiscuous and because their sex acts were at less risk of transmitting the virus) were some of the primary caretakers of sick and dying gay men, and they were some of their primary advocates. After that, they were treated significantly better by gay men. I am proud to be associated with those women (and with the gay men who handled AIDS with so much goodness, dignity, tenacity, and bravery). Still, there is a lot of us vs. them that I still feel when I hear the word "lesbian." We call same sex attraction "being gay." Why then should I use a different term for myself just because I'm a woman? Maybe that is an unusual reaction. I know my girlfriend prefers to call herself gay to calling herself a lesbian too.

These past few months I have started to soften on the lesbian word though, as I have considered how much toxic masculinity really has impacted my life. But that's a different story for another time.

Additionally, the term lesbian is much more sexualized by straight men than the term gay is. I have spent enough time having my sex life and attractions sexualized by people that I did not invite to do so. I'm over it. So it's one reason the term lesbian isn't my first choice.

Also, the use of lesbian as an adjective gives me the willies. One is a lesbian; it is a noun. That also bothers me as I like that gay is an adjective. (Using gay or gays as a noun also gives me the willies.)

(Hooray! It worked!!)

Thanks for the run-down. Linguistics fascinates me, and you've clearly given it a lot of thought.

On a side note, I looked up the etymology of "bisexual" because Gustave H. gets called that in The Grand Budapest Hotel, and it seemed anachronistic to me. Apparently the earlier term was "ambisexual," and although "bisexual" existed in 1932, it didn't enter common usage until the 50s.

I kind of like "ambisexual," seems to imply a certain fluidity. :-)

[Portia]

http://www.chroniclebooks.com/drop-caps.html

These are gorgeous. <3

[Cognoscente]

Restarted a keto diet on Sunday. Feels good to have a sense of control and purpose in physical health again. Looking forward to my clothes fitting better soon.

[Portia]

I feel like Katya will appreciate this.

I was testing to make sure that our MARC record import still worked for active vendor records. We read the code in the 040 $d if it's there, then the $a.

I misread the c in this as a new subfield, LOL

040 ##
$aUkLcULP

>_<

[Emiliana]

Restarted a keto diet on Sunday. Feels good to have a sense of control and purpose in physical health again. Looking forward to my clothes fitting better soon.

Good for you! Do you use MyFitnessPal? If so we should be friends.

[Cognoscente]

Restarted a keto diet on Sunday. Feels good to have a sense of control and purpose in physical health again. Looking forward to my clothes fitting better soon.

Good for you! Do you use MyFitnessPal? If so we should be friends.

I'll set one up and post it.

[Cognoscente]

Restarted a keto diet on Sunday. Feels good to have a sense of control and purpose in physical health again. Looking forward to my clothes fitting better soon.

Good for you! Do you use MyFitnessPal? If so we should be friends.

And I had no idea bourbon has so many calories.

[bobtheenchantedone]

alcohol has all the calories. every single calorie.

[Tally M.]

The good news: we found and bought a car last night.

The weird news: I got a call when I got home from the police who had recovered my car.

[Shrinky Dink]

I was talking to my dad and he mentioned how Youth Conference went this summer. It reminded me of a time when our theme for Youth Conference was "Steadfast and Immovable" and we were going on a road trip. They wanted to get t-shirts with our theme on a license plate. Steadfast is too big to fit, so it got abbreviated as STDFAST.

[Cognoscente]

I was talking to my dad and he mentioned how Youth Conference went this summer. It reminded me of a time when our theme for Youth Conference was "Steadfast and Immovable" and we were going on a road trip. They wanted to get t-shirts with our theme on a license plate. Steadfast is too big to fit, so it got abbreviated as STDFAST.

Wow. That's.... pretty amazing.

Reminds me of that Arrested Development episode when Tobias got a vanity license plate to commemorate "A New Start."

[Whistler]

The good news: we found and bought a car last night.

The weird news: I got a call when I got home from the police who had recovered my car.