Humor will not be tolerated!! -Portia

While it may not be reassuring, I know the scores of a few Monson Scholars, and all of them scored 35 or 36 on the ACT and had 4.0 GPAs in high school. All of them had taken a fair number of college-level courses in high school and had at least a few notable extracurriculars. I also know that the bishops of potential recipients receive a personal phone call to discuss whether or not the person is worthy (or something like that) to be called a Monson Scholar. I don't know whether leadership and community service are officially factored in, but the process certainly yields a pretty exclusive group strong in leadership and community involvement.

Interesting. I was a Hinckley Scholar 15 years ago, and back then you came to campus for like 4 days of interviews. 4.0 GPA, 33 ACT, zero AP or any kind of honors classes because my tiny rural high school didn't have stuff like that. And pretty sure no one called my bishop.

I was a Hinckley Scholar a bit more recently than NerdGirl. Funny thing is, I actually can't remember everything about the applications process, but I'm pretty sure there was no interview for me, because I think I'd remember that. I was involved in service clubs in high school a bit, but not gung-ho like some people. I got a 34 on the ACT and took several AP classes in high school. (I managed to pass most of them, but I failed one!) The most memorable part for me was that I had to write a couple of essays (I think) to apply, and the prompt for one of the essays was basically this:

"Come up with the ideal prompt for a Hinckley Scholarship essay, and then write an essay in response to your own prompt."

It was awesome. Yes, it did contain a bit of asking-a-question-that-will-allow-you-to-brag-about-yourself-ness, but I'm sure everyone did that. I had fun responding to it anyway.

tl;dr: The expectations and requirements probably vary from year to year, at least just a little.

I'm a Monson scholar. I got 1560 and 1540 on the SATs when I took them, but I think BYU only received my 1540 score for some reason. I had a 4.0 GPA and a long list of extracurriculars, most of which came from having no friends in high school haha. They didn't do any sort of interview or anything, I just got an email about it or something.

I remember there were a few essay questions, but it was just the same scholarship application that was used to apply for all the academic scholarships, instead of there being a separate application.

Now they don't give scholarships to incoming international freshmen, so I just squeezed by on that one!

Zedability wrote:Now they don't give scholarships to incoming international freshmen, so I just squeezed by on that one!

Whaaat? I'd heard that BYU has raised expectations a lot for incoming international students, but this is a new one to me. My mom remembers when BYU was desperate to get international students; she met someone during a study abroad in Spain and people at BYU basically bent over backwards to get him over here. How times change.

My guess is that they probably noticed that international students were losing their scholarships at a faster rate and concluded that they didn't have the capabilities to fairly assess which ones were deserving of scholarships, and that overall more money would be sent to deserving students if they required international students to have at least one year of credits before applying. They've also started requiring transcripts to be audited and converted to American grades by a neutral third party company. It can be incredibly difficult to assess educational standards across countries.

I was the first cohort to not have interviews for what was then the Hinckley Scholarship. (Ten years ago!) A good friend of mine got down to the final interview, but like me ended up with the next level down, the Heritage. (That was also during the time of the matrix, which I understand has returned.) Board reader and Parisian roommate of mine Chalice of Evil was a Hinckley Scholar (and really played it down, which was cool). I think she was the only one I ever met.

33 ACT, 1510 final old SAT, 7 APs (all "5," but I did have amazing high school teachers and small classes), 3.98 unweighted GPA

Now I want to do some research on regression between high school GPA and college GPA (mine weren't strongly correlated) and test scores for SAT and GRE (I swear the GRE is easier, if anything). By "I" I mean "make Zed do it for me."

Yeah, BYU has done a number of things that, in my opinion, are making it incredibly financially difficult for international students to go there, and I tell them this when they call me to ask for money and I say no. I save my donations for the only one of the three universities I've graduated from that isn't doing things that I totally disagree with.

The USA and Canada are both, in general, making it difficult for international students to get into either country, in my opinion. Canada currently requires them to deposit all $50000 or so that they'll need for a 4-year degree into a bank account up front and doles a certain amount out to them month by month.

Portia wrote:Now I want to do some research on regression between high school GPA and college GPA (mine weren't strongly correlated)

Mine weren't either. (College GPA being significantly lower than High School)

My college GPA was significantly higher than my high school GPA.

Marduk wrote:My college GPA was significantly higher than my high school GPA.

Mine too. I had a good-but-not awesome high school GPA (3.2 or something) but a 3.96 college GPA.

wryness wrote:I was a Hinckley Scholar a bit more recently than NerdGirl. Funny thing is, I actually can't remember everything about the applications process, but I'm pretty sure there was no interview for me, because I think I'd remember that. I was involved in service clubs in high school a bit, but not gung-ho like some people. I got a 34 on the ACT and took several AP classes in high school. (I managed to pass most of them, but I failed one!) The most memorable part for me was that I had to write a couple of essays (I think) to apply, and the prompt for one of the essays was basically this:

"Come up with the ideal prompt for a Hinckley Scholarship essay, and then write an essay in response to your own prompt."

It was awesome. Yes, it did contain a bit of asking-a-question-that-will-allow-you-to-brag-about-yourself-ness, but I'm sure everyone did that. I had fun responding to it anyway.

tl;dr: The expectations and requirements probably vary from year to year, at least just a little.

Ah - I bet we applied for the Hinckley Scholarship the same year. I had that same essay question and I absolutely hated it. With a a passion. I couldn't come up with anything and I was at the point of running out of steam. I was on what seemed like my millionth scholarship essay, and I'm a math person. I can write a fairly good analysis paper when needed (pass AP Art History and AP Lit with 5s) but that type of essay just threw me for a loop. I ended up modifying a speech I had written and did not get the scholarship even with my high grades and large amount of extracurricular involvement. I honestly think how much my essay sucked was a good reason I didn't get the scholarship. My sister got it a few years before despite having basically no leadership experience or extracurriculars, (with a much more reasonable essay question that I would have been much more confident answering) so it might have irked me just a teensy bit....

tl;dr - That essay question sucked, and I might still be slightly bitter about it

Indefinite Integral wrote:That essay question sucked, and I might still be slightly bitter about it

It wasn't really a good essay question because it was far too broad. You were either lucky enough to think of what they wanted to hear, or you weren't. (I liked my essay but I still have no idea if they did.)

My high school intellectual rival had more impressive accolades than me, in my opinion, and she didn't get the Hinckley. She was driven and eloquent and AMAZING. So I imagine there is a certain amount of randomness or subjectivity involved in deciding who gets a scholarship, as there probably is with any scholarship application.

Emiliana wrote:

Marduk wrote:My college GPA was significantly higher than my high school GPA.

Mine too. I had a good-but-not awesome high school GPA (3.2 or something) but a 3.96 college GPA.

This is almost exactly [ETA: switched of] where I was at. 3.19, I believe, for college, and 3.98, for high school.

(Having such a high college GPA makes sense that you would get recruited for TFA.)

ETA I have no memory of the essay question. I was more bitter about a certain prestigious West Coast school turning me down, really. I learned from a board reunion that my most serious ex was admitted to Berkeley. I was like, woah.

I went through the Hinckley Scholar selection process around the same time as NerdGirl, back in 1999. I had a 4.0 GPA, 1600 SAT, 35 ACT, lots of extracurriculars, and terrible interviewing skills. I didn't get the scholarship.

(I graduated from college with a 4.0 GPA too, so there's a datapoint with some closer correlation.)

Zedability wrote:The USA and Canada are both, in general, making it difficult for international students to get into either country, in my opinion. Canada currently requires them to deposit all $50000 or so that they'll need for a 4-year degree into a bank account up front and doles a certain amount out to them month by month.

Woah...

Portia wrote:

Zedability wrote:The USA and Canada are both, in general, making it difficult for international students to get into either country, in my opinion. Canada currently requires them to deposit all $50000 or so that they'll need for a 4-year degree into a bank account up front and doles a certain amount out to them month by month.

Woah...

Having worked at an ESL school with mostly international students, I understand the rationale behind these decisions—there are people who take advantage of a student visa just to get into the country and then disappear, plus other people who SAY they have enough money to complete a course and then suddenly appear asking for all sorts of special exceptions and late tuition extensions and whatnot. Asking for a lump sum up front avoids those problems. Of course, that doesn't make the higher requirements right; requiring that much money in a lump sum keeps a lot of good people out of the educational system who would keep their word but don't count with so much funding all at once.

One international student I know in Canada just took out a huge student loan, and is working during school to pay off the loan while the money gets doled out of the government account. He says its stupid because he could have just worked the same hours and paid as he went, but it's working out for him.

I have to prove that I have about $17000 up front every time I come back to the US after a semester break so there's that. I just use one of my dad's bank statements and he doesn't actually pay for a cent of my education haha.

When BYU made that a requirement for international students back in 2008/2009, that was one thing my former piano teacher (who was a Canadian international student) was very upset about. She had an excellent scholarship from BYU (Heritage), but wouldn't have been able to meet the bank account requirement.