Daily Universe editorial: Thurs., June 5th

[Portia]

Women are not, in fact a minority. "149.1 million is The number of females in the United States as of July 1, 2004. That exceeds the number of males (144.5 million)." --U.S. Census Press Release

[xkcd ***]

Women are not, in fact a minority. "149.1 million is The number of females in the United States as of July 1, 2004. That exceeds the number of males (144.5 million)." --U.S. Census Press Release

I didn't know women were still complaining about being a minority.

[Portia]

To put it in context, it was claiming that Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama were both minority candidates. Not so much "whining" as a falsehood.

[Imogen]

xkcd, not to get all ranty, but whenever people who are obviously men say women are "whining" it just really points to the incredible stereotypes that still exist. Women are not a minority, and yet are still treated as nothing more than baby making factories. Women still get paid less than men for equal work. People still think a woman should only to go college to meet a husband, not to better herself or our society. Some people think women shouldn't go to college at all! It makes me angry and sad that our society is still treating women as second class citizens, especially because, as Portia points out, we're not a minority.

But I am so happy Hilary lost that I could just dance. I want a woman for president, but NOT HER!

[Nanti-SARRMM]

xkcd, not to get all ranty, but whenever people who are obviously men say women are "whining" it just really points to the incredible stereotypes that still exist. Women are not a minority, and yet are still treated as nothing more than baby making factories. Women still get paid less than men for equal work. People still think a woman should only to go college to meet a husband, not to better herself or our society. Some people think women shouldn't go to college at all! It makes me angry and sad that our society is still treating women as second class citizens, especially because, as Portia points out, we're not a minority.

But I am so happy Hilary lost that I could just dance. I want a woman for president, but NOT HER!

Yes, us men have all the power, bwa ha ha!!! [/end of chauvinistic rant]

I do enjoy seeing Clinton defeated. I only hope Obama and the other democratic party leaders talk to Hillary and put her in her place so she doesn't use those who voted for her as a key to some power position that she wants.

[SWKT Parachuter]

Oh, stop. I think we all know that whoever wrote the editorial meant under-represented, not minority. They're interchangeable often enough. Am I supposed to give you a pat on the back for being such attentive readers?

[SWKT Parachuter]

I do enjoy seeing Clinton defeated. I only hope Obama and the other democratic party leaders talk to Hillary and put her in her place so she doesn't use those who voted for her as a key to some power position that she wants.

Uhhhhhhhh...in a democratic system, VOTES ARE THE KEYS TO POWER POSITIONS. That's sort of how it works.

[Nanti-SARRMM]

I do enjoy seeing Clinton defeated. I only hope Obama and the other democratic party leaders talk to Hillary and put her in her place so she doesn't use those who voted for her as a key to some power position that she wants.

Uhhhhhhhh...in a democratic system, VOTES ARE THE KEYS TO POWER POSITIONS. That's sort of how it works.

I get that. I just think that she is being incredibly annoying about it. If she was truly interested in party unity, then she would have suspended her campaign sometime after "Super Tuesday" instead of push onward and created all the die hard Clinton enthusiasts with their silly attitude of Hillary having been robbed.

[Darth Fedora]

I do enjoy seeing Clinton defeated. I only hope Obama and the other democratic party leaders talk to Hillary and put her in her place so she doesn't use those who voted for her as a key to some power position that she wants.

Uhhhhhhhh...in a democratic system, VOTES ARE THE KEYS TO POWER POSITIONS. That's sort of how it works.

I get that. I just think that she is being incredibly annoying about it. If she was truly interested in party unity, then she would have suspended her campaign sometime after "Super Tuesday" instead of push onward and created all the die hard Clinton enthusiasts with their silly attitude of Hillary having been robbed.

Well, the only people who really care about party unity are people being represented, not the people doing the representing. I mean, if you're not running for any office and you agree with Democrat politics or whatever, then obviously you want lots of people with your beliefs in positions of power. But if you're in a position of power, then it doesn't really matter what other people think, so long as you can get money and votes. And political parties, when it comes down to it, are really only tools for politicians to get money and votes. If "party unity" would get someone less money and fewer votes (as in Clinton's case), then why on earth would they pursue that goal? I mean, I guess it would be selfless, but...what's the point of that?

[Nanti-SARRMM]

Well, the only people who really care about party unity are people being represented, not the people doing the representing. I mean, if you're not running for any office and you agree with Democrat politics or whatever, then obviously you want lots of people with your beliefs in positions of power. But if you're in a position of power, then it doesn't really matter what other people think, so long as you can get money and votes. And political parties, when it comes down to it, are really only tools for politicians to get money and votes. If "party unity" would get someone less money and fewer votes (as in Clinton's case), then why on earth would they pursue that goal? I mean, I guess it would be selfless, but...what's the point of that?

True, point granted. I just think that Hillary is being so blatant about it and so obviously conniving that it is sickening.

[Imogen]

Well, the only people who really care about party unity are people being represented, not the people doing the representing. I mean, if you're not running for any office and you agree with Democrat politics or whatever, then obviously you want lots of people with your beliefs in positions of power. But if you're in a position of power, then it doesn't really matter what other people think, so long as you can get money and votes. And political parties, when it comes down to it, are really only tools for politicians to get money and votes. If "party unity" would get someone less money and fewer votes (as in Clinton's case), then why on earth would they pursue that goal? I mean, I guess it would be selfless, but...what's the point of that?

True, point granted. I just think that Hillary is being so blatant about it and so obviously conniving that it is sickening.

she is! that's what is driving me crazy! now that she's lost, she's making sure everyone knows she wants to be VP. um....you bad mouthed obama all over the US. do you really think he WANTS you for VP? cause i don't.

she used her husband's years in the white house to get into the senate, and now she tried the same for the presidency. i'm glad that plan backfired.

AND...AND...why is she saying caucuses are undemocratic? they were fantastic when her husband won them 16 years ago. but now she doesn't like them because she lost. the only way she can even pretend to claim she won the popular vote is to get rid of the caucuses because obama won those by landslides. so, we shouldn't count votes in caucuses, but we can count your stolen wins in michigan and florida? all votes count! (unless they're not votes for her. then, who cares?)

she's like that girl you don't ask to dance because you know she'll never leave you alone!!! i really hope she's not the VP choice. that would make me think less of obama. she needs to apologize to him for all the thing she said.

[Nanti-SARRMM]

she's like that girl you don't ask to dance because you know she'll never leave you alone!!! i really hope she's not the VP choice. that would make me think less of obama. she needs to apologize to him for all the thing she said.

I don't think she will be. From what I heard on the news, the republicans have been playing movies of her on their website of her saying that she has crossed that thresh hold to become president, and McCain as well, but Obama hasn't. That and McCain is using her same arguments pretty much. And then when Obama says that McCain would be better than Bush, well according to Clinton he crossed a line in supporting, or routing for the competition. Hypocrisy.

But yes, I do agree that everything she has done, has been to win. She talked about Super Delegates, saying they could support or switch over to her. Which Failed. She supported the caucuses, until she lost them. She didn't speak out against the decision of banned votes of Florida and Michigan until she needed them. This is going off some news article I read the other day, though I am too lazy to look it up.

Going back to the whole womens are a minority thing, it has only been an issue because Clinton brought it up to get sympathy votes. She never imagined that she could lose, and spent this whole time trying to destroy Obama as if he were a lesser candidate. Now she has lost, and has to do a lot work to undo the damage that she did. If she had conceded like Romney and other did when they were behind, then all this Clinton fanaticism wouldn't be an issue. But instead she perpetuated all the slander about Obama and allowed her supporters to be more fanatical than Ron Paul's own followers. Frankly, with the mess she made, she doesn't deserve a thing in my opinion. Sure she got a lot of votes, cool, but since when in a Democracy does the loser get rewarded as well?

I am not Democrat, maybe leaning towards that way (still not sure). I am just anti-Hillary.

[Benvolio]

Women are not, in fact a minority. "149.1 million is The number of females in the United States as of July 1, 2004. That exceeds the number of males (144.5 million)." --U.S. Census Press Release

Back to the beginning topic: the definition of "minority" doesn't always correspond directly to demographics. Women have legal minority status under many federal and state laws and constitutions, despite their statistical majority status. Thus, they are a majority minority. Correspondingly, if Caucasians make up less than 50% of the U.S. population, as is predicted by demographers, they will not be a minority; they will instead be a minority majority. Minority status is more closely related to power than it is to numbers.

[Portia]

Oh, stop. I think we all know that whoever wrote the editorial meant under-represented, not minority. They're interchangeable often enough. Am I supposed to give you a pat on the back for being such attentive readers?

That's actually not what I meant at all. I was thinking more along the lines of Title IX, scholarship quotas, etc. I think some of these programs are misguided, at best. Unlike Imogen, I don't often feel like a second-class citizen or a mere reproductive vehicle. Women have incredible latitude and freedom in this country, and I don't really see the point of cutting viable men's sports just to make way for women's team if it's going to underperform (and I think any of us in college can think of a women's sports team at our school that isn't really carrying its weight).

If there were two scholarships being offered, and the two candidates who were clearly the most qualified on all counts were male, I think they should be the ones to receive it. More often than not, I would expect that at least one would be awarded to a female, who, in this hypothetical example, might be the third-most qualified.

Is this really beneficial to women? I just really don't see how in this country we have faced anything like the same level of discrimination as some minority racial or religious groups. Yes, there is still work to be done on equal pay for equal work, and some of the more extreme LDS ideas about women's roles can be a bit backward, I admit. Yes, women have been absent from the highest executive position (not judicial (O'Connor) or legislative (Pelosi), though!) However, most men treat women well, I would say, and I don't think we have the right to complain when there are honor killings and true workplace discrimination going on in other parts of the world.

[xkcd ***]

I would like to state that I never said "whining". I used the word complaining.

Get off my back.

[Giovanni Schwartz]

I think that Hillary should run as a third party candidate, then she would take half the democrat vote, Obama would take half the democrat vote, and Mccain would get twice as many as either of them and would win the election. I'm thinking the "Bully Moose" Party.

[Werf_Must]

I do enjoy seeing Clinton defeated. I only hope Obama and the other democratic party leaders talk to Hillary and put her in her place so she doesn't use those who voted for her as a key to some power position that she wants.

Uhhhhhhhh...in a democratic system, VOTES ARE THE KEYS TO POWER POSITIONS. That's sort of how it works.

I get that. I just think that she is being incredibly annoying about it. If she was truly interested in party unity, then she would have suspended her campaign sometime after "Super Tuesday" instead of push onward and created all the die hard Clinton enthusiasts with their silly attitude of Hillary having been robbed.

Does anyone else associate "Super Tuesday" with some sort of "Super Saturday" Relief Society Event? They both have Super insert day of the week, but one is an election to decide delegates, whereas the other is normally some kind of crafty project... same difference....

[Nanti-SARRMM]

Does anyone else associate "Super Tuesday" with some sort of "Super Saturday" Relief Society Event? They both have Super insert day of the week, but one is an election to decide delegates, whereas the other is normally some kind of crafty project... same difference....

I hadn't thought of it that way. I think it would be better if they redid the whole primary process thing, so they all campaign until April or so with out any state primaries or caucuses, super delegates can vote I suppose, and then all the states vote on the same day. That way it is more like the general elections instead of a process of elimination based normally off who gets the most early delegate votes.

[Sharona Fleming]

Uhhhhhhhh...in a democratic system, VOTES ARE THE KEYS TO POWER POSITIONS. That's sort of how it works.

I get that. I just think that she is being incredibly annoying about it. If she was truly interested in party unity, then she would have suspended her campaign sometime after "Super Tuesday" instead of push onward and created all the die hard Clinton enthusiasts with their silly attitude of Hillary having been robbed.

Does anyone else associate "Super Tuesday" with some sort of "Super Saturday" Relief Society Event? They both have Super insert day of the week, but one is an election to decide delegates, whereas the other is normally some kind of crafty project... same difference....

Werf_Must, I'd never thought about this whole Super Tuesday and Super Saturday connection, but now it's all starting to make sense. What with that sneaky association and also the heavy use of the word primary, I think politicians are out to get Latter-day Saints because of the Church's policy on not endorsing candidates.

[bobtheenchantedone]

I get that. I just think that she is being incredibly annoying about it. If she was truly interested in party unity, then she would have suspended her campaign sometime after "Super Tuesday" instead of push onward and created all the die hard Clinton enthusiasts with their silly attitude of Hillary having been robbed.

Does anyone else associate "Super Tuesday" with some sort of "Super Saturday" Relief Society Event? They both have Super insert day of the week, but one is an election to decide delegates, whereas the other is normally some kind of crafty project... same difference....

Werf_Must, I'd never thought about this whole Super Tuesday and Super Saturday connection, but now it's all starting to make sense. What with that sneaky association and also the heavy use of the word primary, I think politicians are out to get Latter-day Saints because of the Church's policy on not endorsing candidates.

Oh, you're funny, mate. Welcome to the crew! Er, group? mass? crowd? What are we, anyway?