#56527 Female endowment before marriage

vorpal blade · Post by **vorpal blade** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:41 pm

I'd just like to say a word or two in support of the bishop, who advised the young woman to receive her endowments shortly before her temple marriage, but not a long time before her temple marriage.

As we know, a woman can receive her endowment before she goes on a mission, or when she is sufficiently mature. But if she is receiving her endowment because she is soon to be married, then the endowment experience is a little bit different. Unfortunately due to its sacred nature I can't talk about it in detail. I think it is for this reason that bishops are counseled to advise young women to wait until shortly before the marriage, in case the marriage should be called off.

NerdGirl · Post by **NerdGirl** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 5:16 pm

I think you're probably right about that, vorpal. I knew a girl once who received her endowment several months before her wedding day, only to have her fiance change his mind a few weeks before the wedding. For a long time afterwards, it was very hard for her to go to the temple because the endowment was so connected in her mind with her ex-fiance. That bishop has likely seen a few too many marriages get called off at the last minute and doesn't want the temple to become something negative for this young women in the event that her marriage doesn't take place.

krebscout · Post by **krebscout** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 5:21 pm

I think I know what you're talking about - I was just thinking about this myself, as we just saw my sister-in-law through for the first time in preparation for her upcoming mission. It's a good point. A subtle difference, but an emotionally significant one.

Damasta · Post by **Damasta** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 5:23 pm

I know what Vorpal's talking about and I can see another reason, besides what NerdGirl said, that it could be problematic for the woman. When a girl who is about to be married receives her endowment, she shares something very sacred with her husband-to-be. If the wedding is subsequently called off, she has to live with the knowledge that that young man has that information. In the eternal scheme of things I doubt it matters much; the Lord will take care of all mistakes and misunderstandings. But it could still cause the woman grief, thus the recommendation is designed to spare her that, not imply inferiority on her part.

vorpal blade · Post by **vorpal blade** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 5:51 pm

I agree with Nerdgirl, krebscout, and Damasta.

Gimgimno · Post by **Gimgimno** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:03 pm

Damasta nailed it.

Post by **C is for** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:07 pm

Here's where I think I'm confused.

My sister's coming up for her endowment prior to her marriage (this might, in fact, be her question, since it's about a month before her wedding). I think she's just gonna have the straight endowment like I had. Then in the week before her marriage (or the day before, or whenever) she and her fiance will have that special moment.

Maybe I'm wrong, though -- I'll find out next week. But this is the impression I had.

habiba · Post by **habiba** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:10 pm

C is for wrote:Here's where I think I'm confused.

My sister's coming up for her endowment prior to her marriage (this might, in fact, be her question, since it's about a month before her wedding). I think she's just gonna have the straight endowment like I had. Then in the week before her marriage (or the day before, or whenever) she and her fiance will have that special moment.

Maybe I'm wrong, though -- I'll find out next week. But this is the impression I had.

Is that how it works? If the bride has previously received her endowments do they still do that "special moment"? (Is that even an appropriate question outside of the temple?)

And how have I never even THOUGHT of that question in the four some years since I did my endowments?

Gimgimno · Post by **Gimgimno** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:11 pm

habiba wrote:
C is for wrote:Here's where I think I'm confused.

My sister's coming up for her endowment prior to her marriage (this might, in fact, be her question, since it's about a month before her wedding). I think she's just gonna have the straight endowment like I had. Then in the week before her marriage (or the day before, or whenever) she and her fiance will have that special moment.

Maybe I'm wrong, though -- I'll find out next week. But this is the impression I had.
Is that how it works? If the bride has previously received her endowments do they still do that "special moment"? (Is that even an appropriate question outside of the temple?)

And how have I never even THOUGHT of that question in the four some years since I did my endowments?

Yes, they do. I won't go into the details of how it's altered, but yes, they do.

TheAnswerIs42 · Post by **TheAnswerIs42** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:45 pm

I remember when I was getting married my Bishop told me that I could only have the . . . special moment . . . if it was within a week of my actual wedding. I always thought that was a church rule, but perhaps that was just his rule? But yes, if you have already taken out your endowments, you have a "short session" with your betrothed right before your sealing.

On a side note, "special moment" sounds like a really weird way to phrase this to me. If you are not endowed, and now confused, I think Damasta's description is the better one.

Imogen · Post by **Imogen** » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:38 pm

i'm not gonna lie, calling it "special moment" makes it sound like they consummate their marriage in front of people, like royals used to do in centuries past. i'm sure that's not at all what it is, but that's what it reminds me of.

Post by **C is for** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 6:55 am

I think that "special moment" was great for one-time use, but the repetition has made it sound really weird. I think I'll go edit my second and call it "sacred" instead.

Imogen, that's not what it is. That's why "exchange of sacred information" is more appropriate and accurate.

bismark · Post by **bismark** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:31 am

Strange way of saying things.

Imogen,

Part of our sacred ceremony is entering into the "Celestial Room" (you can see pictures released by the church here: http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/temp ... _room.html), which to us symbolizes heaven or being in the presence of God. Usually it is done alone, but as part of the marriage ceremony, it is done as a couple, which as you can guess has deep symbolic meaning to us.

I don't think there was anything too sacred there to be discussed.

Damasta · Post by **Damasta** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 11:53 am

Imogen wrote:i'm not gonna lie, calling it "special moment" makes it sound like they consummate their marriage in front of people, like royals used to do in centuries past. i'm sure that's not at all what it is, but that's what it reminds me of.

Ah ha ha! Imogen, you made me laugh. I didn't know that royals used to do that. But I know that's how the ancient Israelites did it. I've been told that the marriage at Cana, spoken of in the Bible (Jn. 2:1â€“11), was actually a consummation ceremony, not a wedding. Awkward!

Rest assured that the LDS people keep sexual acts very private.

Imogen · Post by **Imogen** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:32 pm

Damasta wrote:
Imogen wrote:i'm not gonna lie, calling it "special moment" makes it sound like they consummate their marriage in front of people, like royals used to do in centuries past. i'm sure that's not at all what it is, but that's what it reminds me of.
Ah ha ha! Imogen, you made me laugh. I didn't know that royals used to do that. But I know that's how the ancient Israelites did it. I've been told that the marriage at Cana, spoken of in the Bible (Jn. 2:1â€“11), was actually a consummation ceremony, not a wedding. Awkward!

Rest assured that the LDS people keep sexual acts very private.

no wonder they needed more wine...that's super awkward.

thanks for the pictures, bismark. those rooms are huge! i don't want y'all to say anything you're not supposed to, but is a person in there totally alone or is someone else in there with them?

TheAnswerIs42 · Post by **TheAnswerIs42** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:49 pm

There are usually many people in the Celestial Room at one time. You are done with the endowment when arrive in the room, so you can spend as much time as you want in there, praying and meditating and what-not. No matter how many people are there, it is as quiet as a library, so it is a wonderful place to rest and consider everything.

NerdGirl · Post by **NerdGirl** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:16 pm

Imogen wrote:
no wonder they needed more wine...that's super awkward.

Yeah, seriously! I don't think I would ever go to anyone's wedding if that sort of thing was going to happen.

chillygator · Post by **chillygator** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:29 pm

NerdGirl wrote:
Yeah, seriously! I don't think I would ever go to anyone's wedding if that sort of thing was going to happen.

Saves a lot of time teaching sex ed, at least.

vorpal blade · Post by **vorpal blade** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:48 pm

Damasta wrote:But I know that's how the ancient Israelites did it.

No, that is not the way I did it.

Seriously, I'd like to see some evidence of that. Now, if you would like some wild speculation about what really happened at the marriage in Cana I refer you to the Journal of Discourses.

NerdGirl · Post by **NerdGirl** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:57 pm

vorpal blade wrote:
Damasta wrote:But I know that's how the ancient Israelites did it.
No, that is not the way I did it.

Now that is the funniest thing I've heard all week. I literally lol'ed.