Courtship

[Portia]

The End of Courtship?is currently incredibly popular on NYTimes.com

Reminds me of the infamous

A "date" must pass the test of three p’s: (1) planned ahead, (2) paid for, and (3) paired off.

Elder Oaks's speech was given when I was 17, just a couple of weeks before I came to BYU. (Back when no one talked about the economy, no one had Facebook, and Lena Dunham wasn't mentioned more than either in the Times.) It was somewhat unpopular and controversial in my crowd, who chafed at the child-bride stereotypes. Now, I'm like "preach!"

It's still entirely possible to be wined and dined, to go to a football game, foreign film, or decent restaurant with an actual human and not with a pack of bros. I'd argue that it's the only way to really get to know someone, interacting one-on-one. I don't see any real paucity of real relationships at BYU, but I have seen the age creep up since the halcyon days of 2005, to be sure. (How much of that is self-selection due to MY age creeping up while remaining unmarried is a good question!)

Guys, do you follow the three Ps, or are you of the "I’m here with a bunch of friends from college." school? Girls, is the fact that I have been on "proper" dates with at least 5 normal, attractive men in the last year some kind of rare coup, or about normal? Does that fact that we have no drinking culture influence our adorable tweeness as Mormons? Because I feel like there is a NCMO culture, too, but that it doesn't eliminate or supercede dating.

[Zedability]

I once went on a date with El Corazón Sólo. He asked me ahead of time if I wanted to go, it was just the two of us, and he paid for everything. At one point we were talking about my missionary - surprise surprise - and I cut myself off and apologized for being rude and talking about another guy on a date. To which his reply was, "Wait, this is a date???" Hahaha. Once I pointed it out, he agreed that it was, indeed, a date.

(It's a funnier story if you know him in person, because he probably went on more dates than the rest of the ward combined. Somehow, this one slipped his notice.)

[bobtheenchantedone]

The very, very few dates I went on before meeting Marduk all had those p's, but the best at following them was the non-Mormon who asked me out while I was in Florida. My experience with him was much more how I'd expect a "normal" dating experience to be (meet, find things in common, exchange numbers, go to dinner which he pays for, everything isn't incredibly awkward, etc.)

[thatonemom]

My first thought on this was that Portia was much younger than I thought. Most of my single friends are young professionals around 30, and for some reason I thought Portia was, too. Sorry about that!

Anyway, most of my dating friends don't seem to have trouble being asked on Elder Oaks-approved dates, except that it's almost always with guys who aren't Mormon. (that may be because it's harder to find single, Mormon guys in the 30+ age range). So I don't think the idea of courtship is completely lost.

I remember most of the dates I went on at BYU meeting the three p's, but I wonder how much of that is selective memory...

[Portia]

My first thought on this was that Portia was much younger than I thought. Most of my single friends are young professionals around 30, and for some reason I thought Portia was, too. Sorry about that!

Anyway, most of my dating friends don't seem to have trouble being asked on Elder Oaks-approved dates, except that it's almost always with guys who aren't Mormon. (that may be because it's harder to find single, Mormon guys in the 30+ age range). So I don't think the idea of courtship is completely lost.

I remember most of the dates I went on at BYU meeting the three p's, but I wonder how much of that is selective memory...

My boyfriend turns 30 this year and I was an incredibly young Board writer. (Retired at 20.) If you met me first in real life, though, I bet you'd peg me at 22 at most.

The guys who ask me out range from non-Mormon to not-active. I feel like this is my calling - everyone else goes to med school, starts a business, or reproduces, and I'm like "ladies! Dating advice from flyover country!" I will make millions. B-)