Humor will not be tolerated!! -Portia

Craig Jessop wrote:I'm learning the hard way to just keep my mouth shut unless I'm with people I know get how the Church really works.

There is a certain wisdom in only speaking to those who share your personal opinions on theological matters. Especially once you know how everything works.

Marduk wrote:Craig, it has been my experience that those who want to blindly follow, will, regardless of any evidence in support or in repudiation of it.

The same holds true of those who don't want to blindly follow.

What about the people who blindly follow until they learn about something disturbing, and then their (brittle) faith crumbles?

Then they either decide to not blindly follow, OR decide to abandon the ideals completely. Either way, those options are always open, and one who blindly follows will eventually come upon them.

You guys. It's about to freaking SNOW, and our 5K is in TWO DAYS. Crap.

Craig Jessop wrote:I'm learning the hard way to just keep my mouth shut unless I'm with people I know get how the Church really works.

An interesting and somewhat cryptic quote. How does the Church really work?

thebigcheese wrote:

Craig Jessop wrote:I'm learning the hard way to just keep my mouth shut unless I'm with people I know get how the Church really works.

An interesting and somewhat cryptic quote. How does the Church really work?

Through humans who aren't immune to making mistakes.

Dead Cat wrote:

thebigcheese wrote:

Craig Jessop wrote:I'm learning the hard way to just keep my mouth shut unless I'm with people I know get how the Church really works.

An interesting and somewhat cryptic quote. How does the Church really work?

Through humans who aren't immune to making mistakes.

Shhhhh!

Heh heh. That's about what I figured he meant, in the context of the discussion. I guess I got hung up on it because of the sentence before:

Craig Jessop wrote:And those who do know the full story are apostate.

Tao wrote:

Craig Jessop wrote:I'm learning the hard way to just keep my mouth shut unless I'm with people I know get how the Church really works.

There is a certain wisdom in only speaking to those who share your personal opinions on theological matters. Especially once you know how everything works.

I can never tell when you're being sarcastic . . .

Tao is sometimes sarcastic?

This changes everything...

Marduk wrote:Tao is sometimes sarcastic?

See, that's what I don't know.

thebigcheese wrote: It was really surprising they were brought up in the last conference, especially because it seems as if the First Presidency disallowed the talk to the Brethren shortly thereafter.

Craig, which biography is this from? The one called Spencer W. Kimball or the sequel called Lengthen Your Stride?[/quote]

It's from Lengthen Your Stride.

@Everybody: my last post came across far more arrogant than I intended it to. I apologize, though I think my opinions are somewhat arrogant. It's a flaw. I'm working on it.

@Dead Cat: EXACTLY.

I believe our Church leaders can be and usually are inspired, but I also believe that they can be and sometimes are uninspired. I also believe that they don't need inspiration on most issues, but that we should still sustain their decisions even if we disagree. Sustaining does not mean we have to agree. And disagreeing does not make us apostate or reflect upon our testimonies in any way. And if we disagree, we have the right to make our leaders aware of this; I'm not advocating making a scene at stake conference, but I am advocating speaking up at ward council or talking to the bishop about something he said in his chastity lesson (which I, of course, have NEVER done). The hard part is when they think that the member is confused about what they said because, of course, they're the bishop and right, and the member acknowledges this fact. Does anybody have a suggestion on how to say "bishop, I think you're wrong" without coming across as combative?

Craig Jessop wrote:Does anybody have a suggestion on how to say "bishop, I think you're wrong" without coming across as combative?

Give him smiley face stickers first?

Craig Jessop wrote:Does anybody have a suggestion on how to say "bishop, I think you're wrong" without coming across as combative?

A sticky situation, no doubt. All I can say is, be sensitive and try to put it as gently as possible. Also, try to support your reasons for whatever your opinion is. If it's general authority quotes, go with it. If it's scripture, go with it. If it's just personal preference or a matter of etiquette, be up front about that and try to explain yourself. Beyond that, I don't know of anything more you can do. If it's something that really concerns you, you could always take it to the Stake President. But with minor things, all you can really do is submit your suggestions and hope to persuade them. And then chill out about it! Most things really aren't a big deal.

Here's a little personal story...

Right before I got married, I had a roommate who really hated our bishop. She thought he did everything the wrong way...and by the book, she was right about some things. These were her biggest concerns:

• - He allowed unsupervised overnight activities with both genders.
  - Most ward activities had zero spiritual connection, and he was cool with that.
  - He wouldn't use the ward budget to buy Ensign subscriptions for the whole ward.

Well, she brought up these concerns in Ward Council on multiple occasions, and he basically shot her down every time. After a while, she got fed up with it and ended up moving out of the ward, largely because of her disagreement with his leadership.

You guys are far too on topic for the random thread.

Thebigcheese, what 5K are you doing? My husband's first triathalon is on Saturday too. Here's hoping it gets slightly warmer around here.

It's the Operation Smile 5K.

Uh, let's just say that me and my husband are very heavily involved in organizing it, and we're super stressed about the weather. Usually, about half of our participants register on race day, so bad weather could really affect that...and we need the money! As of right now, we're barely covering our costs (putting on a 5K is ridiculously expensive). So, if we're going to make a significant donation to Operation Smile, we're really banking on good weather for Saturday. You know how people pray for rain and stuff? Everyone should pray for NO RAIN on Saturday.

42, I'd regulate it, but I have no powers in this section. Oh, to be random chatter moderator....

I have meant to be switching out the on-topic posts, but I am too lazy. Maybe tomorrow.

Okay, and the new topic is...feet. Go.

Returning to the real world is really weird when one has been reading about years-old Harry Potter fandom drama for a couple of hours...