Honor Code Change

[Indefinite Integral]

Anyone else seen this yet? Thoughts?

[Zedability]

Great if the case-by-case evaluations actually lead to more religious freedom, not so great if it's just a convenient wording to change to avoid legal issues while still being repressive behind closed doors.

Tangentially related: I've realized it really disturbs me when the HCO assigns punishment/essays/tasks as part of a student's "repentance." Go ahead and be the gatekeeper for a code of conduct we've signed onto, but repentance is a spiritual process and HCO administrators don't have spiritual stewardship over students. It's not a calling. When the HCO places itself in charge of "repentance," that feels icky to me. If an LDS student has broken the Honor Code in a way that also breaks the commandments, the HCO could refer the student to his or her bishop and ask the bishop to submit a brief followup report as to whether the student actually met with them and whether the student worked with them or refused to work with them (like literally two yes/no questions, that's it), but having a paid university administrator decide what a student needs to do to repent, and whether they've repented? No. Assign essays and community service, provide written warnings and suspensions, view first-time offenders differently than repeat offenders, but don't call it part of the repentance process. That's between the student, God, and possibly an actual ecclesiastical leader.

[Cognoscente]

This article is super confusing. It's a new change, but it happened almost a year ago? And it seems like they only changed it enough to avoid legal issues, while still giving them license to expel students for a loss of faith, entirely at their discretion. It's a step in the right direction, I guess, but not much of one.

[mic0]

"Great if the case-by-case evaluations actually lead to more religious freedom, not so great if it's just a convenient wording to change to avoid legal issues while still being repressive behind closed doors."

That's about what I was thinking as I read it. Yeah, sounds good! I sure hope BYU actually follows through on the spirit of the law. While "applying" for an "exception" sounds better than only living in fear of being expelled, I have a hard time believing it is going to be a fair process.

[TheBlackSheep]

Well this is what I get for getting my news from Facebook groups instead of here. The article I read was decidedly more hopeful and now I feel gross about this.

I'm with Zed and others. I worry that case by case is just a way to say they'll still kick people out, just one at a time.

I don't talk about it all that much, but I was made to go to church for six months so that I could receive the diploma I had already completed all the coursework for. To add insult to injury, the bishop (who was the one setting the requirements for my EA) called me to the committee that reached out to less-active members of the ward. I was in a really vulnerable place and this only hurt me. It served to completely destroy any chance that I could fit the LDS church back into my life (to be fair, once I quit going in 2009 I never really considered going again, but this happening in 2010 did not help). BYU was the worst time of my life, and this policy is a big reason why.

[Cognoscente]

Well this is what I get for getting my news from Facebook groups instead of here. The article I read was decidedly more hopeful and now I feel gross about this.

I'm with Zed and others. I worry that case by case is just a way to say they'll still kick people out, just one at a time.

I don't talk about it all that much, but I was made to go to church for six months so that I could receive the diploma I had already completed all the coursework for. To add insult to injury, the bishop (who was the one setting the requirements for my EA) called me to the committee that reached out to less-active members of the ward. I was in a really vulnerable place and this only hurt me. It served to completely destroy any chance that I could fit the LDS church back into my life (to be fair, once I quit going in 2009 I never really considered going again, but this happening in 2010 did not help). BYU was the worst time of my life, and this policy is a big reason why.

This fills me with rage. It's spiritual extortion.

[Portia]

I find the article confusing.

-- supporting same-sex marriage isn't "leaving the Church." Not even the most hardline of the very top leaders claim that.
-- equating having a "faith transition," which is a vague term, to being an LGBT student, seems weird to me
-- this was already a case-by-base issue (n.b. I got my diploma without any problem because I won Bishop roulette. I did become more-active of my own volition, but still, I don't think that's an actual change)

[Craig Jessop]

I've read like four news articles about the change and still don't get what the change is. Can somebody explain it to me like I'm five?

Also, +1000 to what Zed said about the HCO. I get that it exists, and why it is necessary, but they overextend their boundaries soooooo much.